Thursday, July 22, 2010

Ayton's Cave update

John Howard has cleaned up some of the projects in the Cave, he posted details on the new problem database - thanks John.

Seeing as pretty much every problem/link goes through Caroline's Traverse and Loco Total would people care to comment on their grades. The original grades given by Dave and Caroline were V4/5 and V8 which translates to 6b/6c and 7b (Dave has it at 7c at The problems are the cave are very different from granite cliimbing and very stamina dependant so its not easy to say but I would think CT is about 6b and LT around 7a/7a+? What do people think?
Delirium7BDublinHowthAyton's CaveSit start at the obvious chalked right hand sidepull at the back of the cave, squeeze and heelhook your way along the hanging tufa to reach the start of loco (-destroyer extension ~6c/7a), and finish as for loco totalJohn HowardJune 2010
Solstice7BDublinHowthAyton's CaveClimb loco total to the obvious halfway jug before heading directly through the blank looking roof to the crack, finishing at the lip. A beautiful series of moves involving an undercling, incut crimps and intricate footworkJohn HowardJune 2010
Eon7B+DublinHowthAyton's CaveThe link-up of the destroyer extension into solstice, amazing, get on it!John HowardJuly 2010
Eclipse7A+DublinHowthAyton's CaveA variant to solstice moving left from the jug to a right-hand sidepull/pinch before making a long move to a deep juggy slot(often wet), the roof crack can be gained from this, finish at the lipJohn HowardJuly 2010


  1. I think Carolines feels harder than 6b, maybe 6b+. If the grades are right for the others then I'd say you were about right at 7a/+ for loco then.

    On the other hand if they were in the arch Matt would have graded them 5a and 6b respectively :P

  2. Pierre was adamant it was more like 6a. His point was that the first few moves are just very straight forward jug pulls.

  3. I would find the cave hard to grade. This is particularly because you can try all the moves from the deck - i.e. you can keep pulling on and wire the crux. If these moves were on a straight up problem and you had to get through all the previous moves before you got to try the crux each time, would it be graded harder becuase you would spend longer on it? For example, for Carolines traverse, you would have to do all the moves each time you wanted a go at trying the last and crux move...

  4. The difference between 6b and 6b+ is nominal, id go 6b for fun. Not finished total Loco i asked Barry and he garaded it NIB (not impossible for Barry) I think 7a/+ its just longer as a boulder problen than anything id normally do.

  5. Ha, I find it very funny that this is exactly what Dave said would happen when he first posted up about the cave :-) For my part, when I played on Loco it felt considerably harder than any of the 7a's i've tried/done.

  6. caroline's 6B+

    loco 7A+ the way i do it.. but Eamon's sequence is apparently easier (though not as cool) so might well be 7A

    Solstice 7B spot on

  7. Heya lads, glad to see people enjoying the cave! Now onto the real fun, the numbers! Think we can agree that the cave is tricky to grade simply because of the fickle conditions and the length and sequency nature of the problems, for carolines I'd say 6bish is fair, can feel piss or impossible depending on conditions.

    For Loco, I now think around 7a is closer to the mark, simply because conditions have improved, the holds have had more traffic and more efficient sequences, kneebars etc have been found, also agree with barry's point; so it's a completely different problem to the way it was first climbed by dave, and i can completely see where he's coming from with 7b/c, and fair play again.

    When I first did it it seemed like 7b, simply because it was a battle with conditions, finding sequences etc, so it felt a bit epic and definitely comparable with other 7b's ive done, so I based my grade guesses for the newer stuff on it being 7b, so now that its more 7aish I think its a safe bet that their grades can drop a notch or two, consensus will determine how much, will try and sort out a topo for the newer stuff/projects to make things clearer.Cheers for the heads up on the tarps dave too, they're perfect!

  8. Wow... cool to see so much talk about the Cave!

    Maybe 7a is closer to the mark for Loco as it was done in the middle of a very busy day and i had spend alot of time trying all the different lines. Before climbing in the cave i had spent some time in Parasellas and Llanberis and could do Leftwall traverse and Jerry´s roof within a go or two any session. They´re both long problems but less steep. I felt the grade was between the two but had no real frame of reference and without any real sequence for Loco i just powered through the line making big moves between the more obvious holds... I threw the grade out there as what i felt on the day but completely accept i may have been Way off.

    As for Carolines trav, she worked it from the start each go and had alot of damp holds near the finish - with good conditions and a sequence anything from 6a to 6b+ could hit the mark.

    And Great going John et al for all the link ups... can´t wait to have a play during my next visit home!!! Keep cranking!!